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We Are the Walking Dead
Beware of Biters
Do you blame Daryl? 
27th-Jan-2017 03:59 pm
Hi everyone,

This is another just for fun poll. I thought it might help to get us through the hiatus. We know that Daryl blames himself for Glenn's death, but do you? I lost count of how many Saviors our group had killed before they finally ran into Negan, but I think it was close to 50. If you look at it from Negan's side, killing 2 people from Rick's group compared to the 50ish that Negan lost almost seems like a small price to pay.

So, what do you think?

Poll #2062032 Was Glenn's death Daryl's fault?

Do you blame Daryl for Glenn's death?

Yes, Glenn would have lived if it weren't for Daryl's actions.
10(34.5%)
No, Negan was trying to break the group and he was going to kill someone else anyway.
19(65.5%)
Rick and Daryl
Comments 
27th-Jan-2017 09:32 pm (UTC)
Nope. I believe Negan was already in bloodlust mode and was going to kill someone else anyway.
28th-Jan-2017 05:27 pm (UTC)
I agree with you. Bloodlust is a good word for it, too *shudders*
28th-Jan-2017 11:09 am (UTC)
I think he chose Glenn because he was disappointed with Abraham's death and needed something that caused deeper shock. So he chose someone who wasn't the main guy but who had already shown he was very close to someone else in the group (i.e. when he'd threatened Maggie and Glenn reacted badly to that). Daryl's punch was just the reason he needed to do it all of a sudden.
28th-Jan-2017 05:33 pm (UTC)
Those are interesting thoughts. I hadn't really looked at it that way before. All this time I've been wondering why he picked Abraham and Glenn instead of Daryl and Maggie. Abe and Glenn were two healthy men that were capable of going out and getting him supplies. Daryl was injured and Maggie was sick, so Negan's choices didn't make a lot of sense to me from a strategic standpoint.

Negan is really good at reading people though, and I think he could tell by Abraham's body language that he was never going to fall in line with how Negan did things. And like you said, with Glenn's outburst before, he could tell he had close connections to others in the group.

I don't blame Daryl though, and I don't think Maggie does either given her anguished cry when they took him away. I'm very curious to see how they react towards each other going forward.
29th-Jan-2017 11:38 am (UTC)
I always thought Negan was purposefully trying to take out Rick's "second". I'm pretty sure he said something to that effect. He just assumed that was Abraham the first time. I think that's more become Daryl in the show, but they made a smart move not killing him off.
1st-Feb-2017 07:08 pm (UTC)
Negan definitely taunted Rick asking if he'd just killed his right hand man, but I think he was trying to twist the knife a little bit deeper.

I really think at this point killing off Daryl is something the show wouldn't be able to recover from. They already took a big hit just doing what they did with the cliffhanger upsetting so many people, then the gore of the premiere that turned so many people off for good, and Glenn being one of the ones to go when he was loved by so many. I think (and hope) that Daryl is pretty safe as long as NR wants to stay ;)
29th-Jan-2017 11:34 am (UTC)
Hard for me to answer the poll. I don't believe it was Daryl's fault at all (it was Negan's!), but I also don't know that Negan would have necessarily killed someone else that time.
1st-Feb-2017 06:55 pm (UTC)
Negan would have necessarily killed someone else that time

Interesting point. It's really hard to say. Negan says and does a lot of horrible things, but he does seem to have a set of rules that he actually sticks to. It may be a very warped moral code by most people's standards, but he seems to believe in keeping his word.

As much as I hated the cliffhanger, I'm kinda glad the show set things up this way. It's a complex issue and gives us lots to discuss and think about :D I guess we'll never really know the answer, but I don't think Daryl will ever truly forgive himself.
29th-Jan-2017 11:17 pm (UTC)
I believe it was Daryl's fault. Negan's bloodlust seems to be random at times (like killing Olivia). Maybe he enjoyed killing Glenn because of his obvious concern about Maggie.

I'm still pissed. The group isn't the same without Abraham, and ESPECIALLY without Glenn. His optimism and moral certainty were one of the few "positive" items in the show.
1st-Feb-2017 07:01 pm (UTC)
Hmm. I don't think Olivia was all that random though. Picking her as the one to die? Yes, that part was random. But I think he is so freakishly attached to Lucille that Rosita trying to kill him and damaging his stupid bad meant someone had to pay. He almost has an eye for an eye system going.

I'm still pissed too. I still miss Glenn and Abraham a lot. They were two of my favorite characters. But when I try to think about it objectively, I can't see them fitting into this world anymore as the show is now. Their storylines were over. It sucks, but hell, I still miss Hershel.
30th-Jan-2017 08:43 am (UTC)
Yeah, I think Negan was out for blood anyway. If not Daryl someone else would have cracked eventually and since Glenn had that first outburst that Negan so "graciously" allowed I think that is why he targeted Glenn.
3rd-Feb-2017 12:21 am (UTC)
I agree with you on both counts. I think Negan was out to make a big impression on this group in order to break them, and I think since Glenn had the first outburst that's why he went back to Glenn as punishment for the second.
30th-Jan-2017 02:02 pm (UTC)
I have to add thoughts to this thread because #1 it's a "hot" topic that divides fans and #2 I find it interesting if one can discuss and debate which I think the TWD World want us to do. :D

The question here is actually two folded. Is it Daryls fault and do you blame him?

I can blame Daryl because it was his action that was the catalyst(excuse) for Negan to kill one more and that is fact. Simple enough. But I don't think it's his fault. I'd say he is a victim of circumstance. And that's why I think someone would have ended up killed anyway. Negan had all the Power here and to me it was clear he was not finished or he wouldn't have started taunting Rosita.

This can later explain Rositas action that got Olivia killed and Eugene taken. She was also a victim of circumstance. You can blame her, sure but I don't think you can say it's her fault for the same reasons as Daryls situation.

This also leads me to parallell Spencers thinking. He absolutely blamed Rick for Everything and I can certainly see his point, but had it not been Rick it's fair to say the Dead would have come sooner or later and people would have ended up dead anyway. Maybe not his family, who knows really but the point I am trying to make is that they are all victims of circumstance. All but Negan. Negan is the one in Power and Control. (At the moment anyway! Let's hope that Changes soon!)
3rd-Feb-2017 12:40 am (UTC)
Sorry it took me a while to get back to you on this comment. I moved over the weekend and was without internet for a couple of days and this was such a great comment I wanted to give it some real thought. Again, I agree that it's a hot topic that's still dividing fans. I see a lot of discussions about it on other websites.

I also agree with you that Negan wasn't finished and that's why he started messing with Rosita. He wanted to get some kind of reaction from somebody, so he probably wanted someone to snap and give him a reason to do exactly what he did.

And yes, you can blame Rosita for Olivia getting killed, but as you said, she was a victim of circumstance. She felt like somebody had to try to do something to take Negan out and she was prepared to give her own life to do it. She didn't mean for Olivia to die or Eugene to get taken, but drastic actions have harsh consequences, especially when it comes to Negan. I think he takes pleasure in making others suffer for what they did - like killing Glenn for what Daryl did, and killing Olivia for what Rosita did. He even told Rick in the premiere if he didn't cut off Carl's arm he'd kill the whole group and everyone back in Alexandria but keep him alive for a few years just to let him "stew on it".

I didn't like Spencer, but I could definitely see where he was coming from. Rick's group showed up and until then they'd been safe, and within a short period of time (I don't really know how long it was in the timeline of the show), his entire family was dead. But like you said, with or without Rick, the walkers would've been a problem sooner or later. And so would Negan.

I think we'll be seeing Negan for a long time, but hopefully things between the two sides start to balance out in the next half of the season!
3rd-Feb-2017 01:19 pm (UTC)
I find it sad that fans are so... how should I put this... negative and hateful towards the characters because they did/or didn't do things in a certain way. For sure you can disagree on it and think a character did a stupid move, of course, but why so much negative hate? It just takes the fun out of it and before I found this comm I was feeling so tired of just reading the negative.

I'm glad the people here can disagree to not disagree on something if it should come to that. At least here no one will jump on you for thinking differently. Not what I have seen so far at least! Civil dicussions and different opinions can be fun, and hey, I have come to view a scen or two differently since finding out how other people have reacted to it. Sometimes you miss things or doesn't understand what's happening. So to me it makes it more enjoyable to share, but you need to do so with respecting other views. Um. Not sure why I came to blab about this now but I did. *lol*

but hopefully things between the two sides start to balance out in the next half of the season!

I sure hope so!! I am excited it's less than 2 weeks away. If I'm taking in what the actors have said it seems 7B will be better paced. Here's hoping!

3rd-Feb-2017 01:41 pm (UTC)
I don't really get the hate either, but that's kinda just how every fandom seems to be. On the internet at least. I had to call my cable company last night because they sent us a box without a DVR and that wasn't gonna work for me with TWD coming back, heh. I told the guy on the phone that and he said "first of all, I'm proud of you for watching The Walking Dead", and from there a routine customer service call veered off into a 20 minute conversation just about the show. He was very animated and mostly positive about it and even he was taking a wait and see approach with the Negan stuff rather than giving up on the show yet. It was funny and kinda awesome.

As for hating a particular character for why they did this or that, I just look at it as they're all doing something to move the story forward. Look at Gabriel. People *hated* him back in season 5 but a lot of people like him now, and some of that was deliberate on the part of the show, and some of it was just fandom's typical pile-on reaction.

One thing I have noticed is that almost nothing is put into this show without some intent, and sometimes it's really easy to miss something obscure that turned out to be important foreshadowing. So yes, it's great to have places like this to discuss stuff!

I'm pretty spoiled for the back half, and I think 7B will be a lot better. Will it be the show it was in earlier seasons? No, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. We couldn't watch them run around in the woods forever. Right now, I'm just happy to still be along for the ride.

Edited at 2017-02-03 01:44 pm (UTC)
5th-Feb-2017 06:00 pm (UTC)
Haha what an awesome guy! Cool that one can connect with the most random people just because you tend to Watch and like the same shows. :)

Hmmm. I feel I may sound like a hypocrite based on previous episode comments I've made so to clarify... I mean I think you understand me but just in case, because I am one of those that have said I hated Gabriel but has changed my mind about him this season. So what I meant in my comment above is that hating a character can be ok but it is what you do with that character hate that I am weary of.

Like you said, I'm sure there is some kind of plan and these are all different types of characters with different kinds of experiences so of course they deal with what happens to them differently. Just think how boring it would be without that!? They are all on a personal journey and for better or worse we follow their every step. And we just like some characters better than others but that doesn't mean the character we like less, or even hate, are characters that deserves the kind of hate I'm mening. You know what I mean?

I was spoiled for all of 7A and I wasn't with all of the previous seasons so now that I can compare I will definitely do whatever I can to stay away from spoilers. I want to have the suspense of not knowing what will come. It's just so hard to avoid if you want to spend time in this fandom cause the spoilers are everywhere and without warning it pops up.

Anyway, I'm enjoying the ride too. :)
5th-Feb-2017 06:27 pm (UTC)
It was a lot of fun talking to him! He said that he didn't want to like Negan but he was so damn funny it was hard not to laugh at some of the things he says. Which is where I'm finding myself as well. That doesn't mean I'll ever forgive him for killing Glenn and Abraham, or that I don't want Rick's group to kick his ass. But I can still enjoy JDM's performance. Sometimes villains are fun to love to hate. The Governor, I just hated.

I didn't bring up Gabriel because of anything you said specifically, no. I hated him in season 5 myself when he sold the group out to Deanna. But I've changed my opinion of him and I like him now. I just thought he was a good example. I do understand what you mean, I don't like seeing all the hate directed towards certain characters or actors. I cringe at some of the things people say to Chandler Riggs on Twitter. He's still a kid, it's not okay to wish him dead. I find that kind of thing very aggravating, so I stay out of a lot of it. Everyone will have different favorites or characters they can't stand and that's fine. Honestly if a main character was making me *that* miserable I wouldn't be watching the show in the first place, so I'll never get the constant bashing.

As you said, they're all on a different journey and they all have different personalities and ways of doing things, and different things they contribute to the group. I still think it's fun to think about how most of these people wouldn't even like each other if it weren't for the ZA (Rick and Daryl, in particular), but now they really are a family.

I wish I could stay away from spoilers. I did enjoy the show more when I wasn't spoiled, but I can't seem to help myself, heh. I think part of why I keep reading them is because our seasons are so short and we have to wait soooooo long for new episodes.
4th-Feb-2017 02:46 pm (UTC)
Hard to say. I clicked yes, Daryl's fault, because I feel like if no one else had resisted after Abraham's death, Negan might not have killed anyone else. I think his choice of killing Abraham was very strategic - taking out the guy who visibly seemed to pose the biggest threat to his control. He needed Rick alive, but broken, to keep the rest of the group under control. And just spending five minutes with that group, Abraham was clearly the one least likely to follow Rick's lead and submit to Negan.

I think everything Negan does has a reason, he's kinda scary levels of brilliant, and I think that if Daryl hadn't thrown that punch, he wouldn't have killed Glenn. When Daryl did, he did basically the same thing he did when Rosita tried to kill him. If he had killed Daryl, or Rosita, he'd have created a martyr and INSPIRED Rick's group to fight harder. But no one wants to be responsible for the death of a loved one, so when he punishes someone else for their attempt, it scares the others out of trying something similar. :(

On the other hand... Daryl could not have known how it would play out, and they're so used to fighting for their freedom, their survival. They've never really LOST before. It was natural that he'd resist, and natural that he'd never suspect how it would play out. :/

So yeah, I think it was his fault, but I don't blame him - if that makes sense. :/
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